Israeli Defense Forces CT Operation

For the Israel Defense Forces, CT never stops. Here’s a story straight from the IDF, about the Lotar CT unit.

Naturally, it’s a filtered recounting, but it’s interesting to see what friendly foreign forces are up to. (And, against the global jihad, everybody fighting it is a friendly foreign force).

At 16:00, eight terrorists infiltrated the village of Naham and went on two killing sprees. A team of soldiers from the Duvdevan unit were the first to respond. After exchanging fire twice, the terrorists fled to a nearby building and took 15 civilians hostage. The soldiers killed two terrorists before they entered the building. In exchange for the hostages, the terrorists demanded the exchange of 426 prisoners before 00:30.

Duvdevan maintained their observation posts around the building and snipers fanned out to cover it from all angles. Nearby, two Lotar assault teams prepared to breach the building.

Snipers are often thought of as primarily shooters. But that’s not how military and CT planners think of them. We know they’re precise sources of combat intelligence, sensors that collect unfiltered ground truth. Their observation and intelligence collection abilities are why we raise, train and employ them — their ability to deliver precision fire is a welcome bonus. This operation illustrates that pretty clearly.

In a hostage crisis, information is the most vital resource there is. You need to know the layout of the building, how many terrorists are inside, where they’re located, and what weapons they’re using. The town hall sent the building blueprints, and IDF intelligence teams were searching through pictures and videos to find where the doors, windows, and other entrances are located.

Intel began to arrive. Snipers saw a terrorist playing with wires on the third floor. The hallway was open to the outside, like a balcony. The building had both a ground floor entrance and an entrance to the second floor.

By 23:00, the two Lotar assault teams had divided the responsibilities.

Do Read The Whole Thing™. to see what happened next.  We will spill one spoiler, though: this realistic-sounding operation was a training exercise for the Lotar and Duvdevan units. Given its complexity, it sounds like a certification or a course culmination exercise, much like we’d do to certify a bunch of new guys.

It was actually the Israelis who first taught us not to take terrorist prisoners, “because the [censored]s just inspire more hostage taking.” Instead, you ID ’em and give ’em two in the hat. The canoe across the River Styx, as it were. Dunno if that’s still Israeli (or American) practice. It should be. All these assclowns play tough guy when interrogated, anyway; you learn more off a dead guy’s PC than you’re going to learn off the live guy, so why bother?

In any event, the article is a rare glimpse into IDF CT training. Enjoy.

(Editor’s note: We know what you’re thinking. Where’s the Civil War Sharpshooters article? Hung up in the writing. It’ll be published when it’s good. Sorry ’bout that. -Ed.)

31 thoughts on “Israeli Defense Forces CT Operation

  1. redc1c4

    and when they’re dead, dump them at sea, so the Paleostinians can’t use the corpse for propaganda.

    1. LFMayor

      I always thought that the “car swarm ” following the the TOW strike on leadership transports looked like a fine place to drop off a rockeye.

      Use the bodies as bait.

      That and I’m shocked at the barbarity of the idea that you can simply kill your enemies into defeat. / Sarc off.

      1. redc1c4

        just ONE Rockeye?

        you’re not thinking big enough.

        i’ve also wondered why the IDF doesn’t attack the Hezbolah/Hamass parades with all their “military” units involved…

        after all, they are legitimate targets, very nicely concentrated and out in the open.

        1. Tennessee Budd

          Years ago, I heard a BBC news reader refer to them the latter group as “Ham-ass”. Just their pronunciation (just like they say “Don Joo-ahn” for Don Juan, but I liked the implied pork-related slight, & “Ham-ass” they’ve been to me ever since.

          1. Haxo Angmark

            keep laughing, jackasses. Here’s Hezbollah Shi’a militia rescuing a Syrian city from Isramerica’s pet Sunni Jihadis. The attack is disciplined, up-tempo, fearless and merciless, with heavy and accurate covering fire:

            1) search then click (link defective) “youtube Hezbollah POV GoPro Helmet Cam CQB Footage from Zabadani”

            2) also: http://youtube.com/watch?v=1HmnxVvDN6E

            3) and http://youtube.com/watch?v=PO1eaJ7tQOg

            Israel now rates Hezbollah as World #5 combat efficient ground force. And wisely so: last time Zion tried to ‘jack south Lebanon, it did not go well, and Hezbollah is even more disciplined and better armed now.

  2. Badger

    Eagerly awaiting the Civil War sharpshooter article, being at the point of Spottsylvania in Vol. 3 of Shelby Foote’s benchmark trilogy covering that. And some Union senior leadership not faring too well on the swing of the pendulum after pronouncing “they couldn’t hit the broad side of an elephant” or words to that effect.

    1. Hognose Post author

      Apologies. Have actually spent the bulk of the weekend sleeping! And the rest of it, goofing off, like watching a football game.

  3. 68Whiskey

    “…it’s interesting to see what friendly foreign forces are up to. ”

    Real question, Hognose: are they really friendly? I know you’ve briefly touched on working with the IDF before. My impression of them wasn’t great.

      1. 68Whiskey

        Both. Wasn’t impressed with the way Israeli battlefield medicine worked, and our erstwhile hosts exclusively held attitudes of sneering superiority. We could bring literally nothing to the table, because the Israelis had already figured out the best way to do things long ago.

        Anything else I can clear up for you? Probably not, since you likely already know the “best” way to respond. In my admittedly limited experience, Israelis always do.

        1. medic09

          I would be very interested in knowing more about the flaws you perceived in IDF combat medicine and the context in which you were working; but we can’t steal the thread. So I guess we’ll have to leave it at your observations above.

        2. Kirk

          I’ve found, over the years, that it’s not wise to extrapolate across entire groups when you only have limited exposure to small component parts thereof. Additional problems come into play when you consider the differences in culture, background, and age of the participants. What you perceive is not always what is going on, and it bears consideration of that fact when trying to develop an idea of what you’ve experienced later.

          I’ve dealt with some Israelis that seemed incredibly arrogant; later consideration and experience taught me that a lot of that is just cultural, how they come across to the average American. In actual fact, what I perceived as arrogance was more an example of confidence, as expressed by an Israeli. It can be annoying, but it’s also not ill-meant. Some foibles of the Israelis can really, really grate on Americans; likewise with us to them.

          I’ve found that it’s just best to keep your head down, ignore what you perceive as provocatory, and deal with the realities of things rather than the perceptions.

          A problem a lot of American troops have with our allies in general is that we’re not used to working with and among truly different cultures; we think everyone thinks like us, behaves like us, and reacts to things like us. That simply isn’t the case, and it requires an open mind, and a refusal to take offense at things, until it is absolutely, crystalline-clear that offense is really meant.

          1. W. Fleetwood

            Second the motion. I had some glancing contact with some Israelis in Africa during the late 70s and early 80s, before the “Peace for Galilee” go round. I, and just about everybody else involved, came away feeling they were arrogant know-it-alls. Of course the South Africans felt that way about the Rhodesians, the Rhodesians felt that way about the South Africans, and everybody and their dog felt that way about the Americans.

            I suspect that when you put young, aggressive soldiers who are, justifiably, proud of their units together for a short period of time the friction will lead to a “Yeah, well, those guys just piss me off!” outcome more often than not. (c.f. US Marines and US Rangers.) It takes time and some serious sweat, if not some serious blood, to overcome this

            However, if one does have the time, and there is a serious work out / work through it becomes obvious to all that the people who do this kind of work are a whole lot more alike than they are different.

            FWIW.

            Wafa Wafa, Wasara Wasara.

    1. bloke_from_ohio

      Sometimes the state of Israel has different interests than the US. That is a given, and they live out the countries have interests not friends cliché to a T. But you cannot really hold that against them.

      Given how the state’s mere existence is toxic to many nations around the globe the US needs or chooses to negotiate with makes them a troublesome ally before afore mentioned cross purposes are even considered. Whether the nations/groups who get butthurt of Jews living in that part of the desert are worth dealing with is a debate for another time.

      Given the country’s documented penchant for spying on the US I would not want the IDF within about a click of any SCIF or safe I cared about. I don’t hold it against them though. It is tough being them and we are a really good nation to steal secrets from.

      I have lots of respect for them and what they do.

      1. medic09

        In your opinion, is Israeli spying in the US any more problematic or significant than also-documented US spying on Israel and other allies? Though we of course know that the US would never spy on its closest allies such as, say, Germany or Great Britain. /sarc/ Seriously, EVERYBODY spies on EVERYBODY worth spying on, whether friend or foe. So why is it even relevant? I ask this sincerely. Despite being an arrogant know-it-all by dint of nationality, I like to learn not only what others thing; but sometimes more importantly – why.

        1. Kirk

          People who complain about allies having intelligence gathering operations going inside their bigger, more powerful allies have a special technical term applied to them by people of clue: Fucking morons.

          As much power as the US has, the Israelis would have to be a special kind of naive not to be trying to figure out what the hell we are doing. And, hopefully, once they do figure that out, maybe let us know, too?

          I only draw the line on folks like the Israelis trying to manipulate things like elections. That’s strictly a US privilege, and those smartass Jews should mind their own fucking business, the way we… Do…

          Oh. Yeah. That’s right… The glorious God-Emperor Obama tried to influence Israeli elections, didn’t he? Huh… Kinda puts a different shoe on the foot, don’t it, now?

          Facetiousness aside, I would really, really love it if Bibi were to show up at Trump’s inauguration, sidle up behind Boy Barack, Wonder-child, and whisper in his ear, while they watch Trump take the oath of office: “See that? That’s what happens when you fuck with Israel, bitch… Enjoy prison, motherfucker.”.

          Even if Bibi had nothing going on with the election, I kinda wish he’d just make the effort, and make sure the rest of us get to see the look on Oblahblah’s face when he’s done whispering.

  4. medic09

    As long as we’re on the topic, Netflix has an Israeli TV series called Fauda. It is a story of a CT unit/team. If I had to guess, I’d say it is modeled on a Border Guard team. I’m not a high-speed guy, but from what little I can tell, the show is very well done and feels quite on-target for a TV entertainment show. Check it out. You all can practice your Hebrew and Arabic.

    Also, the book The Ghost Warriors by Katz is a pretty good read about CT troops in Israel.

    1. Sando182

      I had a look at Fauda on your recommendation. Intense! I don’t think I have the nerves for undercover work like that.

  5. medic09

    Interesting tidbit about this unit. It was founded in the 70s, and in my time (the 80s) it was a “rejects” unit. I say that tongue-in-cheek. The candidates for Lotar were the guys who for some reason couldn’t complete pilots’ or naval officers’ training, sometimes some other high speed unit. All high quality folks, and they were offered this unit as their consolation prize. The complete selection course runs about 3 months, and the unit training runs a bit over a year.

  6. Rob

    I wonder if israelis use the Recondo school template of a “final exam” against soon-to-be-room-temperature muj.

    1. medic09

      Rob, I don’t know about all units, nor about what is standard today. In the 80s, even us low-speed guys did some operations at the end of our training period. When I was the rotating senior medic for a training cycle group of very basic infantry recruits (they would graduate at Rifleman 5, when most of us finished our training as Rifleman 7 at least), we took them down for an extended period of operating ambushes against infiltrators along the Jordan River. On the scale of things, it wasn’t considered all that dangerous; but it did mean that they had to do all the things that an infantry soldier and squads do with the real live chance of getting shot at. The high speed units had much higher expectations of their soldiers at the end of the training cycle.

  7. SPEMack

    Pop interacted with the IAF on an ad hoc basis. As in pushing equipment to them out the back of his C-5A during the Yom Kippur war. He remarked that their Phantom drivers were “good sticks” (high praise from my Old Man) but said they were a bit put off by the whole having to be resupplied by the US.

    I always admired the IDF view on uniforming.

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